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"...if anyone makes the assistance of grace depend on the humility or obedience of man and does not agree that it is a gift of grace itself that we are obedient and humble, he contradicts the Apostle who says, "What have you that you did not receive?" (1 Cor. 4:7), and, "But by the grace of God I am what I am" (1 Cor. 15:10). (Council of Orange: Canon 6)

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  • Rev. John Samson
  • Rev. David Thommen (URC)
  • John Hendryx
  • Marco Gonzalez

    We are a community of confessing believers who love the gospel of Jesus Christ, affirm the Biblical and Christ-exalting truths of the Reformation such as the five solas, the doctrines of grace, monergistic regeneration, and the redemptive historical approach to interpreting the Scriptures.

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  • « Penal Substitution a Sixteenth-Century Innovation? | Main | We all wear glasses »

    So true...

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    Think it Over.jpg


    Calvinix.jpg

    Ask your doctor if Calvinix is right for you.


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    John 10: 26-30 "...but you do not believe because you are not among my sheep. My sheep hear my voice, and I know them, and they follow me. I give them eternal life, and they will never perish, and no one will snatch them out of my hand. My Father, who has given them to me, is greater than all, and no one is able to snatch them out of the Father's hand. I and the Father are one.”


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    "We are often told (I mean those of us who are commonly nicknamed by the title of Calvinists—and we are not very much ashamed of that; we think that Calvin, after all, knew more about the Gospel than almost any man who has ever lived, uninspired), we are often told that we limit the atonement of Christ, because we say that Christ has not made a satisfaction for all men, or all men would be saved. Now, our reply to this is, that, on the other hand, our opponents limit it: we do not.

    The Arminians say, Christ died for all men. Ask them what they mean by it. Did Christ die so as to secure the salvation of all men? They say, "No, certainly not." We ask them the next question—Did Christ die so as to secure the salvation of any man in particular? They answer "No." They are obliged to admit this, if they are consistent. They say, "No; Christ has died that any man may be saved if"—and then follow certain conditions of salvation.

    We say, then, we will go back to the old statement—Christ did not die so as beyond a doubt to secure the salvation of anybody, did He? You must say "No;" you are obliged to say so, for you believe that even after a man has been pardoned, he may yet fall from grace, and perish. Now, who is it that limits the death of Christ? Why, you. You say that Christ did not die so as to infallibly secure the salvation of anybody.

    We beg your pardon, when you say we limit Christ's death; we say, "No, my dear sir, it is you that do it." We say Christ so died that He infallibly secured the salvation of a multitude that no man can number, who through Christ's death not only may be saved but are saved, must be saved, and cannot by any possibility run the hazard of being anything but saved. You are welcome to your atonement; you may keep it. We will never renounce ours for the sake of it.

    Now, beloved, when you hear any one laughing or jeering at a limited atonement, you may tell him this. General atonement is like a great wide bridge with only half an arch; it does not go across the stream: it only professes to go half way; it does not secure the salvation of anybody. Now, I had rather put my foot upon a bridge as narrow as Hungerford, which went all the way across, than on a bridge that was as wide as the world, if it did not go all the way across the stream." - C. H. Spurgeon


    Posted by John Samson on May 18, 2012 03:13 AM

    Comments

    Would Calvin recognize this 'Calvinism'? I think not. He would think you are merely predestinarians who are idolaters for having a picture of the Second Person of the Trinity. Think it over

    Looks like Rupert's been into the Calvinix again :P He is probably right about the image though. About Calvin not liking it that is.

    Rupert,

    I understand the argument but remain unconvinced by it. Much as I respect John Calvin, I don't believe him to be infallible and like many other Reformed people, disagree with him on this issue. I believe Dr. Robert Godfrey would agree with you and Dr. R.C. Sproul would not. In fact, Sproul's Church in Sanford Florida has many images of Christ adorning the walls.

    He would say, as I would that Christ is fully God and fully man, One Person with two natures. Though these natures are never to be separated, we can certainly make distinctions between them. God in His nature never can suffer fatigue, but Christ as a man certainly did. God cannot be hungry yet Christ certainly was. God cannot die, but Christ did (as a man).

    My own understanding is that if Joseph and Mary had a family portrait painted by an artist, I don't believe the artist or the family would have been guilty of idolatry if the portrait included Jesus and was hung in their family living room; nor if Jesus had lived in our day, if a television station sought to beam His sermon on the mount around the world. Any image of this kind would merely be of the HUMANITY of Christ, not His deity.

    I am sure Sproul gets letters from people who see the issue as you do, accusing him of idolatry. Like him, I am sorry if the image I posted offends anyone. I hope you might, in time, come to recognize the distinction I make above, but if not, would wish you God's peace.

    I was wondering how it is possible for a person to believe that God is both omniscient and omnipotent and eternal without at least admitting a soft determinism? It seems to me that if these attributes accurately describe God then nothing can happen without God either allowing it or causing it- thus everything is predestined.

    id like to know what you guys says about this bibleverse.

    1Jh 2:2 He is the propitiation for our sins, and not for ours only but also for the sins of the whole world.
    (ESV)

    id like to know what you guys says about this bibleverse.

    1Jh 2:2 He is the propitiation for our sins, and not for ours only but also for the sins of the whole world.
    (ESV)

    I would want to add,

    Since this is John writing both the letters of John, and the Gospel of John. Dont you think that what he had in mind i John 3:16 was that of Jesus being the atonement for the whole world in the "For God so loved the World" phrase.
    And not only the elect as calvinist often say.

    Another thing,
    I know that it might be relaxing and soothing to be one of the elect since you cant loose your salvation. The problem is that noone knows wether they are elect or not. I know you guys already know this but it is still a fact.

    When i was into the calvinism this completley destroyed me beacause i started to look at my works asking myself if i were one of the elect.

    I have so much more peace right now beacause i know that God will judge righteous everyone outside of Christ and it is at their own cost. They missed the time Jesus walked in their midst. They loved the darkness more than the light. (john 3:19)

    Before the calvinistic view i had more of an arminian view since i live in Sweden. Calvinism isnt as much of here as in the U.S.

    Did you know btw that Jesus said that there would be few elects?

    In Matthew 7 it says:
    Mat 7:13 "Enter by the narrow gate. For the gate is wide and the way is easy that leads to destruction, and those who enter by it are many.
    Mat 7:14 For the gate is narrow and the way is hard that leads to life, and those who find it are few.

    Of course the way is the way of the cross.

    Also another thing i noticed is that in Matthew 24 it speaks of people(christians) love growing cold(v.12) and after that Jesus sais that he who endures to the end will be saved.(v.13)

    and another thing this speaks of is a falling away, the whole chapter speaks of it.

    Isnt it dangerous to think that you cant fall away if you are one of the elect?

    But if you dont know that youre one of the elect how can you be sure of walking in the light right now?

    This boils down to you trusting something you cant know of, and that is the election. Am i or am i not one of the elect?


    I trust in Christ and him leading me through everything i walk through. He choose me and loved me before the foundation even existed. He choose me in Him to eternal life.
    He picked me to walk in Him as he walked and being more like him every day of the week, month and year.

    Why? beacause God choose a people to walk as He walked and live as he lived, and that people is the people that is in Christ Jesus our lord.
    That is to walk in faith.

    He choose me to be righeous, not of my own works but through him, Jesus. And he abides in me cause he says he will and i trust him with that.

    If it is true that God predestined people to heaven and hell, he cannot accuse people of not believing in him as in John 3:19
    They loved the darkness more than the light it says.
    But calvinists say that God made them love the darkness more than light. So God is the one acountable for the deed and not them.

    You might want to check Romans 1:19 aswell.
    "For what can be known about God is plain to them, because God has shown it to them."

    (v.20) ... . So they are without excuse.
    (v.21)For although they knew God, they did not honor him as God or give thanks to him, but they became futile in their thinking, and their foolish hearts were darkened.

    And since they dont want to know God, he led them into things of homosexuality and so on.

    (v.24) "Therefore God gave them up in the lusts of their hearts "

    But this is not the same as God choosing people to hell from the beginning of time.

    This might on the other hand, lead to the homos being saved. Maby, who knows?
    God is love, and love is kind. God wants all people to repent and believe the Gospel.
    1Ti 2:3 This is good, and it is pleasing in the sight of God our Savior,
    1Ti 2:4 who desires all people to be saved and to come to the knowledge of the truth.

    God has everything under control-
    Not God controlls everything, but he has everything under control.

    Just beacause you got power you dont always have to use it.

    Id like to encourage you to test everything i say so that it might be acording to the scriptures. As should i when you will reply.

    Please write if there is a misunderstanding.

    God bless you guys,
    Sam

    Sam,

    You raise so many issues. It would be best to do so one at a time, as it would require a book length response otherwise. However, your questions have been addressed many times over on this blog and at monergism.com

    Regarding 1 John 2:2 here are two articles:
    http://effectualgrace.com/2011/01/15/understanding-1-john-22/

    http://effectualgrace.com/2011/01/15/1-john-22-karate-exegesis/


    I will read more closley later, right now i got things to do aswell as this weekend.

    I do want to ask another more easy asked question:

    Is it a work to believe the gospel?

    Or do God have to make a person born again(regenerated) to believe?

    John S, the reason it seems you appear unconvinced is because you do not understand the Reformed view of the communicatio idiomatum which Calvin believed and was confessionalized in all the Reformed documents.

    But you do agree with Lutherans and Aquinas, Anabaptists, and Rome. So you are in good company when you reject Reformed Christology.

    Rupert,

    In that Dr. Sproul and I hold the same view, would you say that a lack of understanding lies at the root of his Christology also?

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